Posted: 13/April/2006 at 15:08 | IP Logged

"The world may be a playground to you, but to millions of people it is a living hell, a hell largely of our own making. It is the duty of those who enjoy the luxury of Free Will to do their damnedest to make that hell a little bit easier for others to live with. To do any less is to neglect our humanity."


I've heard something like this on several occasions, and I really should provide a good explanation of what I mean by "the world is a playground". It can easily be misinterpreted.

I really couldn't agree more with the above statement. But consider the following:

• A playground, in the literal sense, can be a hell for many kids. Kids can be cruel, and the playground is where the strongest rule and the weakest are tread on. Is it not fair to argue that the world works in similar ways? Yes, let's "do our damnedest", but are we?
  
• I am also questioning the meaning of life, how meaning can be found in a meaningless world, and whether this search, "the prize for which we contend, is overestimated" (Hume). The fact that human beings are able to ask these questions is quite extraordinary. Human beings, life, the universe... everything seems pretty irrational to me, and I'm wondering if I just have to accept this and try to take my life a little bit less seriously. Read more in the Planning/Why? section.
  
• I want to unlearn most of what I've learnt, and try to start over by "seeing the world through the eyes of a child". I know this sounds quite naive and even tacky, but I think that a clearer view of myself and the world will only make me better able to do "my damnedest". Again, see the Why? pages.
  
• "The world is a playground" also relates to music. Music is everywhere, music can be a universal language. Music is one of the few pure subjective forms of expression that doesn't have to be quantified, objectified to be understood and to communicate. My music probably conveys the meaning of "the world is a playground" much better than that clumsily constructed sentence.
  
• Finally, if you believe in god(s), religion, that we were created to do god's(s') bidding on earth... Don't you pretty much have to agree that the world is a playground? That human beings are simply toys in god's(s') hands? That we are puppets in god's(s') playground, marionettes in some (un)godly game?

Hope this answers the criticisms.

Martin

Posted: 14/April/2006 at 17:41 | IP Logged

Phew... a lot to answer!

Firstly, I must point out that every sentence in the last bullet point in my last post above ends in a question mark. I do not claim to hold any absolute truth about anything beyond my sphere of subjectivity. I am setting out on my journey with an open mind (or at least I think I am), and I try to be open to ALL possibilities - even god(s).

I have no idea what my "howler" is, and I would appreciate it if you could tell me. IF this sentence is true: "...that we were created to do god's(s') bidding on earth...", then the rest of the bullet point seems justified. Please explain how it is not, and what "homework" I should be doing.

If I should be doing more homework, why don't you help me out? Or at least point me in the right direction? You seem to be underestimating my willingness to try to see things from different perspectives and to take on new ideas. Have I not created this forum for that very reason?

You seem to be suggesting that my "howler" is that your God, whom I still don't know who is, created us with free will and that we are therefore not just puppets but free agents. Perhaps you also think that God does not interfere in the world. Is that right?

If so, let me give you an example, which may or may not be valid. When I was a kid I once made a labyrinth out of books, and put a couple of hamsters in one end of this labyrinth to see which one would make it out first. There were several routes the hamsters could freely choose from, and they were of course not aware that they were participants in this game. If we pretend that hamsters have free will in their 'natural habitat', where ever that is, can they be said to still have had free will in the labyrinth? I would argue that even if they could freely choose what route to take (or just stay put), and even if I didn't interfere with their choices, their free will was limited by the framework of the labyrinth.

Can this example be transferred to human beings and the universe? If we were created with free will by an uniterfering god(s), we would still be trapped by the framework created by the god(s).

Let's pretend that the ultimate aim a human being could have in a universe created by your God is to go to some sort of a "heaven" after death. (Even if this not true of your particular belief, it would be true for millions or billions of other people.) In such a scenario it could still be argued that we are simply puppets in a game, even if we have been created with free will by an uninterfering god(s) - why would such a god(s) put us through our earthly existence when he/she/it/they could have placed us in this "heaven" straight away?

I have a million other things to say about this, but I also have a million other things to do right now... I'll try to write more later.

Martin

Posted: 21/April/2006 at 03:05 | IP Logged

I'm sorry to report that the hamsters never recovered from the severe psychological trauma they suffered...

According to your definition, I should have said "maze". I wasn't aware of the differences... I really should hang my head in shame - I used to be a D&D dungeon master!!

neem wrote: Is the tragedy, the misery, the poverty we see around us nothing more than the results of God's games? Or are we to blame? Our greed, or willingness to exploit and then to ignore those whom we have exploited? Are there any actions we take that DON'T have a negative effect on someone else? Are you putting the blame somewhere else when you should be accepting it yourself?

That would be exactly my point. We choose freely, and there is no one else to blame. How can a perfect God allow these things to happen? Why put us through our earthly existence at all? What kind of God(s) would get satisfaction from seeing, and upholding, the state the world is in?

However, I see your point with "proving its worth"... BUT, let me ask you this: Can a perfect God create an imperfect universe? 

neem wrote: My point, with the previous questions, was that I cannot simply give you answers. What would they mean to you without your discovery of them? It might sound rather vague, but there you go; it's a journey of self discovery and once you are on it you must be prepared to open your own doors.

Again, we are in agreement. There is no learning but experience. But I would argue that subjective points of view can at least be discussed!

Say you told me that 1+1=3, and that this is objective truth. I would probably argue against that. But if you told me that in your subjective universe it is true that 1+1=3, I would just have to accept it. (Because of your admission that it is a subjective point of view, it wouldn't be too difficult to accept. If, however, I saw you applying this as opbjective truth on, say, a building site, by hammering in only two nails whenever three were required, I would be a bit more worried!) Even if you admitted that it was only subjective truth, I would probably ask you why or how you came to this conclusion, which seems to me like a perfectly reasonable thing to do. You would probably tell me about your subjective experiences resulting in this conclusion, but my subjective conclusions would probably remain unchanged, as I haven't had those experiences. But here's my point: Just by presenting your view and your experiences, you might make me think slightly differently about the question 1+1=x. This might in turn lead me to have an experience of 1+1 equalling 3, which might in turn become my subjective truth. Many "mights", but still worth it, methinks.

Finally, about the "experiment". I have read what you wrote five times, and I need to read it five times more. My initial reaction is that I can identify, to a certain extent, with what you say, but that my label for this... er... "feeling" is something other than "God". I shall take it with me and ponder on it.

Martin

PS! Another point regarding the "playground"... Whether we "do our damnedest" skipping and laughing or with tears streaming down our faces doesn't really make any difference. It's the consequences of our actions, the results, that matter!